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Thread: PIP 0 Points - Pain & 'Best fit' for MR?

  1. #1

    PIP 0 Points - Pain & 'Best fit' for MR?

    Hi all,

    I'm new here and I wish I'd found this site sooner! I applied for PIP in September 2013, finally had my f2f on 31st October 2014 and got my letter turning me down today. I have Ehlers-danlos Syndrome, which has resulted in the following: chronic fatigue, fibromyalgia, chronic joint pain, migraines, heart problems, POTS, multiple hernias, keratoglobus requiring left corneal transplantation in 2012 and subsequent immunosuppressive therapy, right eye currently untreated, hearing loss and tinnitus.

    There are many points where the assessor has completely disregarded what I said -

    Food prep

    The assessor has said that I can cook unaided when I reeled off a list of aids I use, how I only use pre prepared foods because I cannot safely peel and chop. Gave examples of how my Dad has had to come round and give first aid when I've sliced fingers open on knives and tins or burned or scalded myself. I can't handle pots and pans and use a microwave to cook. I cannot safely or reliably cook a simple meal.

    Managing medications

    The assessor said I can do this unaided. I told her I use a medications box which I have to sort myself, very carefully, once a month. I use alarms on my phone to remind me to take medication but I still forget and my parents call or text to make sure I remember. I still forget. After surgery my Dad comes around to administer my medications himself so I don't forget. This us vital so my transplanted cornea does not reject. I cannot take my medications reliably or repeatedly each day.

    Taking nutrition

    The assessor maintained this question was only to do with getting food into my mouth. Which I now understand isn't strictly true. What I didn't say is that I often skip meals due to fatigue (I will fall asleep after I put my son to bed and when I wake up it's too late to eat, or I am too tired to eat). I do not eat in the morning due to nausea. Some days I am only eating lunch. We also pointed out that due to prolonged steroid treatment for my transplant and multiple rejections I am now suffering with dental problems which mean my teeth break and then I find it painful to eat. Not sure if this would count, but it's all a knock on effect of my condition and the treatments I've had.

    Washing and bathing

    The assessor has said I can do both unaided. I said I needed grab rails and a shower stool to be able to do this safely every day.

    Dressing and undressing

    The assessor has said I can do this unaided. I in fact told her I choose clothes based on their ease to put on. Anything with buttons, zips or other fastenings I get my 7 year old child to help with, on a regular basis.

    Communicating verbally

    The assessor has said I can do this unaided. I told her I have 60% hearing loss on my left side and have a hearing aid. I do not wear it because it rubs my fragile skin and causes pressure sores. I am unable to afford a more suitable aid that would not do this and do not qualify for one on the NHS. Therefore I rely on lipreading, which I can only do if I am wearing my glasses. I realise this is dodgy ground - would that count as aided or not? I was able to communicate clearly with her as we were in a quiet room, but once I'm in a noisy environment (even on the street) it's just a wall of sound - very confusing and I can't pick out individual voices. I would say I can't reliably understand verbal communication because it depends on environment.

    Reading

    SHE DID NOT EVEN ASK ME THIS! Part way through the assessment she said "You said you liked reading, didn't you?" Which I affirmed and she typed something.

    What I had said earlier was when she asked me about my hobbies, was that I can read on my 1st generation kindle (flat grey screen, no glare) when the text size is turned up. If she had asked me this question I would have told her of the screen reader and desktop magnifier I got through Access to Work and of the large screens I use and coloured filters I need to read text off a white background. I find street signs etc very difficult if not wearing filter or polarised lenses due to glare and light sensitivity, and attempting any of this without aids results in my getting migraines. I'm really angry about this point.

    Walking

    She bulldozed me into saying I could walk for 10 minutes. I kept trying to argue my condition is variable. But I also maintained; as she had asked me earlier, that I am in constant pain (someone elsewhere told me constant pain should get you 12 points but I can't find this written anywhere). I tried to tell her I can't walk at all without symptoms (ie. Pain), but she said I couldn't say that or I'd be in a wheelchair (yeah, if I could afford one!). She wanted to know how far I could walk before needing to rest, I said rest doesn't alleviate my symptoms. I allowed her to bully me into saying 10 minutes which is blatantly untrue. Some days I can't leave my house (at least once a week), most days I don't leave my office until home time because I can't manage the stairs (which means I skip breaks as the staff area is downstairs). I wish I'd been able to say all this, but she just wanted a quantifiable figure. Reading up on things now I'd say I can do 0-20m reliably and repeatedly (it's about the distance to the tea and coffee machine in the office and I do that 2-3x daily), but after that I over exert and cause knock on problems and post exertional malaise.

    Planning and following a journey

    My Dad accompanied me because there is no way I would have found where I needed to go, got there, parked, walked to the centre without being a big exhausted, sweaty and neurotic mess. I don't do unfamiliar journeys as I get too stressed and then feel unwell. Hell I can't even handle being late to work (nearly fainted from stress of that yesterday)! All the assessor was concerned with was whether I could follow GPS. The ironic thing? The assessment centre's address wasn't in our GPS' list so we nearly didn't find it!

    Other things wrong were - she said my range of movement is normal. I actually refused some of the physical tasks because they would put me at risk. EDS causes hypermobility, where you can move well beyond a normal range, but it is risky and painful to do it. I pointed this out but it has been ignored. My strength and grip was considered normal too, but I think 20 seconds of squeezing her fingers is a ridiculous assessment of strength. She didn't see me struggling with the door when I came in, or how I lost grip on my coffee cup and threw my coffee all over the reception floor before going in (which my Dad quickly cleaned up to avoid a H&S risk)!

    Sorry I've gone on a bit! I have spent all afternoon combing this forum for advice. I've read the stickies several times and think I have a plan of action. ATOS insists on calling my land line only, so tomorrow I'm setting up call divert to go to my mobile as like I said, I'm at work. The whole reason I'm going for this, over 20 years since my health failed and over 13 years since I was turned down for DLA is that I want to afford myself a quality of life that enables me to still work and be get productive member of society. At the moment that is slipping away more and more each year. I don't want to be unemployable before I'm 40, or even before I'm 35 (just turned 33). I spent a lot of money on my education and I want to use it, but I need their support to do that. I'm already on hb, wtc and had AtW help too. My son gets DLA for autism which is why I can get hb and wtc, but I spend that money on him as it's for him. Now I need help for me too.

    I plan on having everything ready for a MR request, and then tweaking once I've spoken to DM and got the full report through.

    Any help or advice gratefully received - especially in relation to what I've put about my case and if I've misunderstood anything.

  2. #2
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    Hi I didnt want to read and not reply but im on my phone and am having a rough time at the moment.

    I have hypermobility syndrome EDS type 3 and fybro so fully understNd your condition and can empathise. I got higher rate care and lower rate mobility on PIP in Feb this year. I had my f2f with a mental health nurse so dont know if that helped me. He was lovely and a bit squemish about dislocations. As evidence i submitted a diagram of my body with each part i have ever injured coloured in red. I detailed the year and injury next to it, then wrote a table of eachinjury with its impact on everyday life. I also gave my most recent consultants report. I also work full time and had to be very firm with my pain v ability and mobility at f2f. I described it as this- most peple who are able bodied are capable of running a 5k race. People will get different times based on ability fitness and training. For some, 5k is easy. Others it is an acheivement after many months of training. For me, going in to the office, using the loo and getting lunch requires the training and stamina of a marathon. It is an acheivement to be celebrated, not an everyday occurance. I want my medal! Hope this helps, happy to answer any questions if you catch me on a better day! Xx

  3. #3
    Thanks so much for your reply, it's great to hear from someone who understands pain vs mobility and ability!

    I don't know what type I have. I have features of 1, 3, 4 and 6. We really thought I had 6, but genetic tests said no. So far no genetic test has confirmed my type, but my consultant is adamant I have EDS and I am a research participant for him. My case is often brought up in clinical discussion for its 'oddness' - although it doesn't help me much.

    I have a whole body of evidence which was not even looked at by the assessor but I hadn't amassed when I applied. I will submit it all for reconsideration though.

    Thanks again for your reply. X

  4. #4
    Senior Member AmyS's Avatar
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    Descriptors

    Hi LittleMissAlien

    These are just a view of those you listed.

    Food Prep Descriptor:
    1. Uses an aid – 2points
    2. Cannot cook – 2points
    3. Reminds you – 2points
    4. Supervision – 4points – you need 24/7 supervision?
    5. Cannot cook or use a microwave someone prepares all meals and sits with you etc. – 8points.

    Medication
    1. Uses an aid – 1point
    2. Someone supervises you up to 3.5 hours per week – 2points
    3. Someone supervises you up to 7 hours per week – 4poiints
    4. Someone supervises you up to 14 hours per week – 6points
    5. Someone supervises you over 14 hours per week – 8points

    Bathing/Washing
    1. Uses an aid or device – 2points
    2. Needs to be supervised – 2points
    3. Assistance to wash hair or below waist – 2points
    4. Assistance to get in and out of bath – 3points
    5. Physical help to wash body between shoulders and waist – 4points
    6. Cannot wash or bathe – someone washes you top to bottom – 8points

    Dressing/undressing
    1. Uses an aid for zips and buttons – 2points
    2. Prompting, someone reminding you – 2points
    3. Someone dresses your lower body – 2points
    4. Someone dresses your upper body – 4points
    5. Someone dresses you completely head to toe – 8points

    Communication
    1. Uses a magnifying glass or hearing aid – 2points
    2. Help to understand complex verbal information – 4points
    3. Help to understand basic verbal information – 8points
    4. Cannot understand any verbal communication – 12points


    Reading
    1. Uses an aid – magnifying glass – 2points
    2. Uses a dedicated device prescribed or provided by a disability group – 2points
    3. Encouragement to read information – 2points
    4. Someone helps you read very basic writing – 4points
    5. Cannot read or understand signs or symbols – 8points

    Engaging with other people
    1. Support of someone with you to engage socially – 2points
    2. Trained qualified person with you to engage socially – 4points
    3. Cannot engage with anyone, which may cause risk or harm to oneself or harm to others – 8points

    Planning or following a journey
    1. Some to remind you and explain the journey – 4points
    2. Someone with you to complete a journey – 8points
    3. Cannot follow unfamiliar roués without assistance, orientation aid, guide dog – 8points
    4. Cannot undertake any journey – 10points
    5. Cannot follow a familiar route without another person or assistance dog – 10points
    6. Cannot do any route - 12points.


    I had to précis this from another site.

    It is so complex.

    From this which exactly are specific to your needs?

    Did you provide them with written reports from GP, Social Care, Occupational Therapist, Nurses, Consultants - do not presume they contacted them. I was told that at a previous tribunal at the end they said it was MY responsibility to do the leg work.

    Who completed the forms for you?
    Last edited by AmyS; 15-11-14 at 22:56.

  5. #5
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    unbelievable

    im shocked you got zero. It must have been a shock for you too. You cope with so much and still look after your child and manage to work too. id say it sounded like a mistake to score zero but hearing other peoples accounts it probably isnt. What it is, is absolutely disgusting! To score a zero makes it seem like the assessor was calling you a liar too! I hope you get this on appeal. i hope people will help you to fight this and get what you need and deserve.
    i dont hold out much hope for myself if someone with your difficulties can score a zero. Im waiting on a decision. Had my f2f four weeks ago now. But at least im prepared for a bad outcome. Plus this site has given me the basic tools to challenge a negative decision. i hope i dont have to as i dont feel up to that.
    good luck with the MR.

  6. #6
    Thanks for your replies. From the list, I self assessed as scoring 11, maybe 12 points, but reading the guidance for assessors I downloaded from here earlier it could be as high as 20+ depending on how things could be interpreted.

    I didn't have reports from anyone as at the time of applying I wasn't really under anyone's care. As I've had a diagnosis for so many years and the NHS only provides you with short term solutions all my referrals were closed and a lot of my consultants moved on. They get to a point where it's like "You've had your x sessions, off you go" and if you're not better, then tough. I started seeing an EDS consultant after I'd applied.

    I last saw OT in 2011 briefly for 2 sessions to remake my wrist supports. My GP knows barely anything and simply printed out my summary care record. I got halfway to the chronic pain clinic before the psych derailed the referral and sent me for CBT for depression instead. I have no involvement with social care/services/nurses. Because EDS is incurable and genetic, unless you are experiencing constant acute health crises there is very little in the way of regular support. I was diagnosed in 2004. By 2005 all 'treatment' had ended.

    Short of forking out to see people privately I don't think I'll be able to provide much in the way of recent reports. Everything is about 10 years old at this point. :/

    I completed the forms myself with guidance from a friend with EDS who got DLA on first application. Obviously things have changed now, but when I was doing the forms DLA had only just been stopped and there wasn't thus wealth of information on PIP that there is now.
    Last edited by LittleMissAlien; 16-11-14 at 02:05. Reason: Missed stuff out

  7. #7
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    have you got the Assessment report,(if not ask them to send you it asap), or do you just have the Decision Makers (refusal) report.

    once you get that you can see where if any points were awarded,you may find you got close to the amount needed, and will then need to expand on these area's to get the points needed.

    it could be possible that you scored 8 points thats the threshold, but the regs say between 8 and 11 for standard rate,so the DM may need showing that you do indeed qualify.

  8. #8
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    I am currently fighting two infections, so this answer might be terser than my usual style. If there is anything you want me to expand on, please ask.


    To get all the points you deserve, it is important to give a good quality explanation of how your medical conditions and disabilities limit your ability to perform the PIP activities. If your descriptions paint a clear picture in the mind of the reader - similar to that they would get from being a 'fly on the wall' but with the ability to understand your symptoms in matters such as pain - you maximise your chances of getting all the points you deserve.

    It will probably help if you read the sticky PIP thread, especially the sections on "Reconsideration" and "An example of how to explain your problems in a way that maximises the points scored", which is about Helen's reconsideration experience. She managed to go from 0 points to enhanced rate of both components using the "painting a picture" approach. Coloured text on these forums are links to follow.

    I suspect you are in a similar position to Helen - there is little doubt that you have relevant medical problems, but the explanations you gave were insufficiently detailed and precise for the decision maker to give the decision maker an evidential basis to conclude any scoring descriptions more likely than not applied.


    When preparing your reconsideration submission, it is important to remember that you need to establish that scoring descriptors more likely than not apply. You do not need to make a pointwise rebuttal of the assessment report - indeed, it's better not to distract the reader from the points in your submission that are relevant to the award of PIP.


    The assessor makes recommendations in their report, which informs the decision made by the DWP decision maker


    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Food prep

    The assessor has said that I can cook unaided when I reeled off a list of aids I use, how I only use pre prepared foods because I cannot safely peel and chop. Gave examples of how my Dad has had to come round and give first aid when I've sliced fingers open on knives and tins or burned or scalded myself. I can't handle pots and pans and use a microwave to cook. I cannot safely or reliably cook a simple meal.
    You've given a contradictory picture which can steer the decision to a lower score than would otherwise apply. The safety issues are clearly serious, but you would need to explain why they are a result of your condition (i.e. a clear link between your medical condition and the safety issues) show they apply on at least half of days for them to determine the outcome.

    If the safety issues do not determine the outcome, the assessment would be on the basis of your aided ability. I can see how this would lead to 0 points, as the explanation you give here (which I guess is an abbreviated version) only explains your limits in terms of safety. I wonder if there are other issues, such as pain and fatigue, which also limit your ability to cook and prepare food.


    With a good quality explanation on safety, you might get to "needs supervision or assistance to either prepare or cook a simple meal" for 4 points. You would have to show that you needed so much help to to prepare and to cook any food safely (including by using a microwave) to qualify for the 8 point descriptor and I suspect this is impossible on the facts given.


    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Managing medications

    The assessor said I can do this unaided. I told her I use a medications box which I have to sort myself, very carefully, once a month. I use alarms on my phone to remind me to take medication but I still forget and my parents call or text to make sure I remember. I still forget. After surgery my Dad comes around to administer my medications himself so I don't forget. This us vital so my transplanted cornea does not reject. I cannot take my medications reliably or repeatedly each day.
    You sort the medication box yourself, albeit with a struggle, so you do not need supervision, prompting or assistance in relation to filling the box.

    You would need to show that your forgetfulness is a result of your medical condition for it to be taken into account for PIP, for example by explaining that your fatigue destroys your ability to remember reliably.


    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Taking nutrition

    The assessor maintained this question was only to do with getting food into my mouth. Which I now understand isn't strictly true. What I didn't say is that I often skip meals due to fatigue (I will fall asleep after I put my son to bed and when I wake up it's too late to eat, or I am too tired to eat). I do not eat in the morning due to nausea. Some days I am only eating lunch. We also pointed out that due to prolonged steroid treatment for my transplant and multiple rejections I am now suffering with dental problems which mean my teeth break and then I find it painful to eat. Not sure if this would count, but it's all a knock on effect of my condition and the treatments I've had.
    The "taking nutrition" activity is fairly narrow - it's about the ability to get food and drink into your body, also about taking nutrition by alternative means if conventional eating and drinking are impossible.

    PIP is about the effect of your medical conditions and disabilities on your ability to perform the PIP activities - you cannot score points based purely on symptoms. Your morning nausea is therefore not relevant, as you could not benefit from taking nutrition at that time. However, if you argue fatigue means you "need assistance to cut up food" or "need supervision to take nutrition" to eat an evening meal, you might qualify for one of these 2 point alternatives on the basis that you cannot take nutrition as often as reasonably necessary.


    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Washing and bathing

    The assessor has said I can do both unaided. I said I needed grab rails and a shower stool to be able to do this safely every day.
    The decision maker would need to be satisfied you needed these aids as a result of your condition to wash and bathe safely, though it sounds like a careful explanation would establish "needs to use an aid or appliance to be able to wash or bathe" for 2 points.


    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Dressing and undressing

    The assessor has said I can do this unaided. I in fact told her I choose clothes based on their ease to put on. Anything with buttons, zips or other fastenings I get my 7 year old child to help with, on a regular basis.
    The activity is about your ability to dress and undress using the clothes you wear, so any day when your choice of clothes means you do not need help will not count. You would need to show that your condition means you cannot dress and undress without help on at least half of days to qualify for "needs assistance to be able to dress or undress their upper body" for 4 points.


    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Communicating verbally

    The assessor has said I can do this unaided. I told her I have 60% hearing loss on my left side and have a hearing aid. I do not wear it because it rubs my fragile skin and causes pressure sores. I am unable to afford a more suitable aid that would not do this and do not qualify for one on the NHS. Therefore I rely on lipreading, which I can only do if I am wearing my glasses. I realise this is dodgy ground - would that count as aided or not? I was able to communicate clearly with her as we were in a quiet room, but once I'm in a noisy environment (even on the street) it's just a wall of sound - very confusing and I can't pick out individual voices. I would say I can't reliably understand verbal communication because it depends on environment.
    As you acknowledge, the case for the award of any points here is rather slender. The assessor would report, accurately, that you were able to communicate verbally at assessment with no problems and the level of impairment required for even the lowest scoring descriptor is high.

    "Needs to use an aid or appliance to be able to speak or hear" would require you to be unable to hear to an acceptable standard without an aid, but your ability to lipread suggests you can hear unaided. "Hear" is a very low level of functionality to reach before this descriptor cannot be awarded, so I think the case here is probably too weak to be worth pursuing.

    As you cope without trained communication support, it is unlikely you could establish the case for any of the communication support descriptors.

    (continues)

  9. #9
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    (continued from first part)

    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Reading

    SHE DID NOT EVEN ASK ME THIS! Part way through the assessment she said "You said you liked reading, didn't you?" Which I affirmed and she typed something.

    What I had said earlier was when she asked me about my hobbies, was that I can read on my 1st generation kindle (flat grey screen, no glare) when the text size is turned up. If she had asked me this question I would have told her of the screen reader and desktop magnifier I got through Access to Work and of the large screens I use and coloured filters I need to read text off a white background. I find street signs etc very difficult if not wearing filter or polarised lenses due to glare and light sensitivity, and attempting any of this without aids results in my getting migraines. I'm really angry about this point.
    Inability to read a couple of sentences of standard sized text should result in an award of "needs to use an aid or appliance, other than spectacles or contact lenses, to be able to read or understand either basic or complex written information" for 2 points. A clear explanation that you can only read using aids and cannot read unmagnified text should secure these points. If you have a copy of the Access to Work report, I would provide a copy - it might help your case in other areas.


    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Walking

    She bulldozed me into saying I could walk for 10 minutes. I kept trying to argue my condition is variable. But I also maintained; as she had asked me earlier, that I am in constant pain (someone elsewhere told me constant pain should get you 12 points but I can't find this written anywhere). I tried to tell her I can't walk at all without symptoms (ie. Pain), but she said I couldn't say that or I'd be in a wheelchair (yeah, if I could afford one!). She wanted to know how far I could walk before needing to rest, I said rest doesn't alleviate my symptoms. I allowed her to bully me into saying 10 minutes which is blatantly untrue. Some days I can't leave my house (at least once a week), most days I don't leave my office until home time because I can't manage the stairs (which means I skip breaks as the staff area is downstairs). I wish I'd been able to say all this, but she just wanted a quantifiable figure. Reading up on things now I'd say I can do 0-20m reliably and repeatedly (it's about the distance to the tea and coffee machine in the office and I do that 2-3x daily), but after that I over exert and cause knock on problems and post exertional malaise.
    If you don't provide clear figures with justification, the assessor has to draw conclusions by questioning. It is possible for your explanation to rebut your assertions about distance.

    Pain only stops walking counting for PIP purposes when that pain is bad enough to amount to "severe discomfort" (this is the same as for DLA), so it is important to explain how pain limits your walking ability. I find this easiest using the "painting a picture" approach - explain the pain when sitting, then when you stand, when you take the first step and so on. This kind of explanation helps the decision maker determine at which point you are in severe discomfort and your walking stops counting.

    I would expect your hypermobility to affect the manner of your walking, so you should explain how this affects your walking.


    If you are severely limited by pain and hypermobility, you maybe should explore your entitlement to NHS Wheelchair Services. The criteria tend to be tough, but you will never know if they will help unless you ask. However, you cannot do anything about this in time for your PIP reconsideration.


    10 minutes creates an implication that you can walk well in excess of 200 metres. A well person can walk about 80 metres per minute.

    Post-exertional malaise needs particularly careful explanation, as it is your walking ability across the day that counts. Unless there is a direct link between walking a distance and your ability to walk later in the day, it is difficult to argue post-exertional malaise affects your mobility even though I know it is a disabling symptom (as it is amongst my symptoms). Nevertheless, you should do your best to include post-exertional malaise in your explanation, as it is part of fleshing out your description into a coherent whole.


    If the decision maker has an explanation that covers the effect of all your symptoms on your walking which appears to be coherent, complete and devoid of exaggeration, it is much easier for them to agree with you.


    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Planning and following a journey

    My Dad accompanied me because there is no way I would have found where I needed to go, got there, parked, walked to the centre without being a big exhausted, sweaty and neurotic mess. I don't do unfamiliar journeys as I get too stressed and then feel unwell. Hell I can't even handle being late to work (nearly fainted from stress of that yesterday)! All the assessor was concerned with was whether I could follow GPS. The ironic thing? The assessment centre's address wasn't in our GPS' list so we nearly didn't find it!
    "Planning and following journeys" is about your ability to make a local journey as a pedestrian, wheelchair user/scooter user and by using public transport. Your ability to drive and to plan journeys as a driver is not part of the activity.

    If you choose not to do something, that will only count as an inability to do that thing if you can show the choice is forced by your medical conditions and disabilities. In other words, the "cannot follow" descriptors can only apply if you can show your ability to do the thing mention has more likely than not been destroyed your medical conditions and disabilities.

    Stress is understandable, but there is a difference in degree between getting exhausted/stressed and "overwhelming psychological distress". "Overwhelming psychological distress" is a high standard - in essence it means that your mental state has become completely disabling.


    Quote Originally Posted by LittleMissAlien View Post
    Other things wrong were - she said my range of movement is normal. I actually refused some of the physical tasks because they would put me at risk. EDS causes hypermobility, where you can move well beyond a normal range, but it is risky and painful to do it. I pointed this out but it has been ignored. My strength and grip was considered normal too, but I think 20 seconds of squeezing her fingers is a ridiculous assessment of strength. She didn't see me struggling with the door when I came in, or how I lost grip on my coffee cup and threw my coffee all over the reception floor before going in (which my Dad quickly cleaned up to avoid a H&S risk)!
    At the reconsideration stage, it's best to think about what examples - such as dropping the coffee - best illustrate the arguments you are putting forward.


    I think you are doing an amazing job by continuing to work to the best of your ability, especially with your responsibilities towards your children. I think the quality of your explanations at reconsideration has the potential to lift you from 0 points, though I don't have enough information to know how highly you could score.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by RaspberryRipple View Post
    Some of what you are saying is quite long winded so I advise bullet pointing rather than over stretching answers as bullet points are much easier to read.
    Structure is definitely important. Bullet points are one way. I found it better to use prose in short paragraphs with structured headings, but it is a matter of personal preference.


    Quote Originally Posted by RaspberryRipple View Post
    You say that your parents sometimes call or text to remind you to take your medication. Then later you say you can only communicate via lip reading. If you are able to use a telephone to take calls then this contradicts what you said about your ability to communicate only via lip reading.
    Well spotted. This is the kind of contradiction that tends to raise doubts about whether the problems are as severe as claimed. If there is something about the truth that could appear contradictory, it is important to explain the possible contradiction.


    Quote Originally Posted by RaspberryRipple View Post
    The problem with PIP is that many people think they are entitled to lots of points as the descriptors seem straight forward. I would be very careful not to get carried away with how others on here perceive points entitlement for example telling you what THEY think you should get. It may not always be entirely accurate.
    I agree. Too often, people read the higher scoring descriptors and conclude they apply to them on a simple best fit basis. This disregards the law that sits around those descriptors. Many of the words and phrases have specific meanings laid down in the regulations. There are requirements found elsewhere in the regulations and in the common law - for example, a problem only counts if it is a result of your condition/disability, the problem must apply on a majority of days and the problem must be established "more likely than not". In time, there will also be case law on the correct interpretation established by the Upper Tribunal and the courts.

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    By deebee in forum Health - help & advice on health issues for disabled people
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 13-10-13, 18:32

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