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Thread: ESA change of address?

  1. #11
    thanks for clearing that up for me nukecad I’m in esa support group income related so in relation to the housing benefit does that payment go to myself or to the new landlord which is a housing association I have pay one months rent upfront at sign up

  2. #12
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    UC is always paid to the claimant unless an alternative payment arrangment is put in place.
    That usually only happens in cases of arrears, and even then it's difficult for a landlord to get a Managed Payment To Landlord (MPTL) set up. It is easier for social housing than a private rental.
    The ethos behind UC is that the claimant should be responsible for looking after their own money and paying their own bills.

    If you are talking about the 2 week run on then with a change of address that will also be paid to you, even if you have direct payments set up for the place you are leaving.
    That's because it's paid by the old council who aren't going to pay it to the landlord you've just left.
    https://www.gov.uk/guidance/moving-f...how-youre-paid

    For rent upfront you could ask the new council for a Discretionary Housing Payment. (The HA should be familiar with that and they often suggest it when they know you are on benefits).
    They are discretionary not a benefit so the council don't have to grant one. They don't need paying back it's a grant from the welfare fund.
    (I'd suggest that if you can save up to cover a half or even a quarter of the advance payment yourself then you may stand a better chance of a DHP for the rest; just my opinion).
    https://www.gov.uk/government/public...using-payments
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  3. #13
    Just a quick question nukecad if you move to a sheltered housing flat does universal credit pay the rent or do you apply through your local council I’ve seen online different answers online because it’s sheltered housing and finally do you get the full amount of rent for sheltered housing many thanks

  4. #14
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    It's not as simple as that, and it's something people often get confused about (and wrong about).

    The rule is not "Sheltered" accomodation, it's "Specified" accommodation.

    "Specified" accommodation includes "Supported" accomodation; where "care, support or supervision" is available and actually needed/used by the claimant.
    People get mixed up between 'Sheltered' and 'Supported', and so talk about the wrong thing.

    See sections 4 and 5 of this (It's from 2018 so there may have been a few changes since):
    http://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/pu...ugust_2018.pdf
    • The care, support or supervision must not be a ‘trifling’ amount – it must make a difference to the claimant’s ability to maintain the tenancy.
    • It’s not enough that the care, support or supervision is available, the claimant must actually take advantage of it – or, if the benefit decision is being made at the beginning of the tenancy before there is any evidence, it must be likely the claimant will do so.
    • The claimant must actually need the care, support or supervision – if it’s provided and the claimant does not actually need it, it doesn’t count.
    So basically while 'Sheltered' accomodation may also count as 'Specified' accommodation, that isn't automatically the case. It also has to have an element of care involved.

    For example a flat in a scheme with a 24 hour warden and emergency pull cords will usually be called 'Sheltered' - but if it doesn't have a care/support/supervision element as part of the tenancy, it isn't 'Supported', and so doesn't class as 'Specified'.

    It's possible that even in the same scheme some residents need and get care/support/supervision as part of their tenacy whereas others don't, so one flat may count as 'Specified' while next door doesn't - but they are both 'Sheltered'.

    As for what can be included in benefit payments it's slightly different between HB and UC.
    In Social Housing both will cover the full rent, but UC usually covers more Service Charges than HB.
    Usually you will see Social Housing 'adverts' listing rent and service charges seperately as well as the overall payment.
    (I was looking at an application myself just before Christmas, but had difficulty finding out just what the service charges were for and so what would or wouldn't be covered by either HB or UC).
    Last edited by nukecad; 04-02-21 at 18:07.
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  5. #15
    Thanks nukecad because it’s not supported housing and sheltered housing was told over the phone from my local council I have to make the claim under universal credit

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by nukecad View Post
    Most of the horror stories are from a few years back, things have got better now.

    There are still mistakes made of course, but there again when were benefits ever run smoothly?

    EDIT- Something was niggling at me and I've just realised what it was.
    You said:
    Did you mean "once I move in"?
    The above was based on you living alone, if you are going to be living with someone else then all the above could change.
    Sorry for the late reply Nukecad only just seen this haven't been on the forums much. Yes if I manage to find a suitable council property my grandfather who's 85/86 will be moving in with me but it would be solely my tenancy

  7. #17
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Hi again Beddz,

    Having your grandfather living with you could make a difference.

    Unless your grandfather is receiving Pension Credit (or DLA/PIP/AA) then as a non-dependant adult he will be expected (for benefits purposes) to pay his share of the rent, even if he is not on the tenancy agreement. (or even if he is not actually paying anything).
    UC call it a 'Housing cost contribution'.

    As you said you get a carer premium on ESA then can we assume that's for looking after your grandfather?
    Which should mean he does have one of the relevant benefits, in which case you should not be subject to a deduction for his expected 'Housing cost contribution'.

    Otherwise, with UC that means that your UC Housing Element will have a 'non-dependant deduction' at a flat rate of of £75.15 a month.

    There may also be an effect on any Council Tax payable.
    Again I think you should be OK there but it's something else to check with your council.

    More about non-dependant deductions from UC-HE, HB, and CTR:
    https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/non-dependants
    Last edited by nukecad; 20-03-21 at 16:00.
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  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by nukecad View Post
    Hi again Beddz,

    Having your grandfather living with you could make a difference.

    Unless your grandfather is receiving Pension Credit (or DLA/PIP/AA) then as a non-dependant adult he will be expected (for benefits purposes) to pay his share of the rent, even if he is not on the tenancy agreement. (or even if he is not actually paying anything).
    UC call it a 'Housing cost contribution'.

    As you said you get a carer premium on ESA then can we assume that's for looking after your grandfather?
    Which should mean he does have one of the relevant benefits, in which case you should not be subject to a deduction for his expected 'Housing cost contribution'.

    Otherwise, with UC that means that your UC Housing Element will have a 'non-dependant deduction' at a flat rate of of £75.15 a month.

    There may also be an effect on any Council Tax payable.
    Again I think you should be OK there but it's something else to check with your council.

    More about non-dependant deductions from UC-HE, HB, and CTR:
    https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/non-dependants
    Yes my grandfather does get Pension Credit/Attend Allowance isn't the allowance for a 2 bedroom property more than £75 per month even on UC? UC is kind of a mystery to me and new even though it's been out awhile ...

  9. #19
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    If it's social housing then they pay the full rent less any under-occupancy charge, (Bedroom tax).
    And of course that could also be limited by the benefit cap if you are in a high rent area such as London.

    If it's a private rental then there is no bedroom tax and the LHA rate for your circumstances applies.
    You get that LHA rate as UC-HE, or the actual rent if it's lower than LHA.
    So if it's a private rental then you may not get the full rent paid by UC. (It was the same with Housing Benefit).*

    But yes - UC HE will be much more than £75 a month, that £75 is just what they take off for each non-dependant adults expected contibution to the months rent.
    It's just an arbitary £75 flat rate for everyone who is expected to contribute so that they don't have to work out different amounts for different circumstances.

    As your Grandfather has Pension Credits (and AA as well) then it's not going to apply to your circumstances and there won't be any non-dependant deduction from UC-HE.

    *For example say I'm in a private rental and my rent is £60 a week.
    The applicable LHA rate for a single person in my circumstances in this area is £68 a week. (Doesn't matter how may bedrooms you have in a private rental, the LHA rate applies).
    So I'd get £60 UC-HE (or Housing benefit) to pay my full rent.
    But if my private rent was £70 then I would only get £68 LHA rate, and would have to make up the other £2 rent from elsewhere.
    Last edited by nukecad; 21-03-21 at 17:21.
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