Brown Envelope Asking To See Bank Statement

[nukecad]

I think I'm very confused!

At the bottom of the letter on the page they work out what you are getting it says savings of lets say £15.000 (I haven't got £15,000) on the form I filled out last year.

Then this new worked out form on the bottom it say's savings of £14,000 (I haven't got £14,00) so I'm taking it as I can't go over £14.000 if I do I would have to tell them & drop the rate they give me?

The amount I have got is more near £15,000 than £14,000 so I need to spend some money to get down to £14,249.99 otherwise they are paying me too much?

I wouldn't worry too much about it.

They are going off what your bank statements for last year/this year say, and not what you actually have at the moment.

Next time you send them a statement they will go from what this last one said to what that new one says.
(I don't think they usually look at all the ups and downs, just what it says at the bottom of each statement they do have).

It looks like as I said they have decided that your savings have dropped by just over £1k since the last time they calculated it (last year) and so they should now be paying you an extra £4 a week.

If your savings do go up or down again by next time they look/calculate then they'll simply adjust for that.

And never forget that the people who type these letters often seem to be dyslexic and make typing mistakes.
Plus they will often re-use an old letter and forget to change things like numbers.

Technically then yes you should tell them each time you savings change by £250 up or down, in practice they are not too bothered as long as it's updated at least once a year and doesn't go over £16K.

Of course if it's a large one-off change, say you get a couple of thousand in or out, then you should tell them straight away.

It probably costs more in wages for someone to look at and recalculate if they did it regularly than the change in payment would be.
Say it costs £10 wages time to recalculate, fill in forms, type/send a letter, etc., and they did it every month that would be £120 a year or £2.40 a week, which is probably more than most payments would change by.

If they want to see statements more often then they will ask for them.

If you want to tell them more often yourself then maybe give them a ring every 3 or 6 months to report a change of savings?
But most people would prefer not to stir them up and just wait until they ask.

[StarBright]

Thanks Nuke,

That's all reassuring. They just caught my account at a lower amount because the day or two after the end of the month my PIP was due which actually means that on average my money dropped by £500 not £1,000 so now it's balanced out again it's tipped back up near to the higher amount so really should only of had £2 extra a week.

It's difficult also not being able to get money out. I don't know what they think of getting money out either as they can't see what it's spent on.

beau,

I hope to get the enthusiasm one day soon!

[nukecad]

They just caught my account at a lower amount because the day or two after the end of the month my PIP was due

I see now where some (most) of the confusion is coming from.

You should really keep your savings in a different account from where your PIP and ESA is paid into.
Just ask the bank and they will set up a seperate account for savings.

PIP, ESA, and other benefits are not counted as savings, they are the money that you live on. (Unless you don't spend them and let them build up).

When calculating your savings the DWP should ignore anything that's been paid paid in that month for PIP/ESA/etc.
But if they are just looking at the bottom line they could miss that that money shouldn't be counted as savings.

I don't think that the DWP have missed it here, but it's giving you the wrong idea of how much of your balance is actually counted as 'savings'.

Putting your savings into a separate account from where your benefits are paid into makes it much easier for everyone, including yourself, to see just what is savings and what is the money that you live on.

[StarBright]

Sorry Nuke,

I confuse everyone

No my savings are in a savings account & my benefits go into my bank account. My savings have not changed at all I've not touched them. However my bank account goes up & down. Adding both my savings account & my bank account together at the time of the bank statement looked like I had a balance of £1,000 less than this time last year.

In fact I had only spent £500 more than this time last year but the day or so after the end of my bank statement I got payed in PIP & ESA in the same week that made a combined balance of only £500 less than this time last year

You said PIP, ESA, and other benefits are not counted as savings, they are the money that you live on. (Unless you don't spend them and let them build up).

That's the bit I'm worrying about, I'm counting every penny I have both from savings account & bank account every time I get a payment either ESA or both ESA & PIP in one week my bank account along with my savings go above the £14,000 (I don't have £14,000 just for explaining as above) I worry that that's counted as being payed too much & becomes benefit fraud if i don't tell them. How much can you let your combined savings & bank account go up before it becomes benefit fraud?

It does worry me you hear of people having to pay back money & even ending up in prison.

[nukecad]

Adding both my savings account & my bank account together .....

I'm counting every penny I have both from savings account & bank account every time I get a payment either ESA or both ESA & PIP....

Please stop doing that. - That is where you are confusing yourself.

As said the money you get paid for PIP and ESA doesn't count as savings, so don't add it it to your savings.

I'll try to explain it a bit more:

Let's say someone starts on the 1st of the month with £11,000 in their savings account and £500 in their current account.
That's £11,500.

They then get paid for PIP the next day, but that is not counted as savings so they still only have £11,500 that is counted.
Then the week after that, and a fortnight after that, they get paid ESA, but that is not counted as savings so they still have £11,500 that is counted.

It doesn't matter that your bank account goes up and down during the month because of PIP/ESA payments and you then spending them, they are not counted as savings.

PS.
You are doing the things that you should by sending them statements when they ask for them.
Unless your savings (not including that months PI/ESA payments) go above £16,000, and you don't tell them for a long time, then you won't have any big overpayment to pay back.
You certainly have no need to worry about prison, that is for very serious deliberate fraud.

[StarBright]

The penny has finally dropped! Thanks so much for your patients Nuke

So basically when asked for bank & savings statements every so often they take the total savings & the total of what you have in your bank account & adjust accordingly each time what they pay you. In the mean time your bank account can go up & down with no problems as it will be adjusted what they pay you next time they ask for statements as what's in your bank account is not classed as savings. Even if your bank account goes up by £1,00 or £2,000 from last time they checked.

(hold's breath with fingers crossed that I've got it right )

[ChrisK]

Interesting thread and maybe I will take nukecad advice on board.

I used to have a separate savings account but when they started doing 0% interest and my current account was paying more, and I under line was paying more, at a higher interest rate I moved everything into my current account.

Have to have a look around for somewhere to put it.

I had a letter about 2 years ago asking for 10 years, yes a whole decade of statements (been disabled at the time for 10 years so on benefits) and at first thought it was a scam with the letter sent to me all being hand written but I took it to a local job centre and they confirmed the best they could that it was genuine so I had to print a realm of statements putting them in 4 separate A4 envelops as not to overload the envelops and sent it off to an office in London by recorded post costing me £11. I ask them to have the decency to call my mobile when they received all 4 envelops and at least they did do that.

As noted above about bank accounts having there highs and lows when you get the call for a statement I’m disabled and have a Motability car and because I need a big car to carry my pavement scooter along for the need of adaptions to the car plus extra cost because its has to be automatic this cost me last time near on £2,000 out of my few thousand saving so you can imagine I have to save hard in the year running up to the car being renewed (this year as it happens is one) so my bank account are artificially high and always worries me I’m going to get one of theses dreaded letters before I have to pay for the car.

I tell them but do they listen, I don’t know.

[StarBright]

Blimey 10 years of bank statements!

I don't drink, smoke, gamble minimal rent, I don't drive, no council tax & there is only so much food one person can eat sometimes my bank account can go up quiet a bit before the next bills are due

[nukecad]

... every so often they take the total savings & the total of what you have in your bank account & adjust accordingly each time what they pay you. In the mean time your bank account can go up & down with no problems as it will be adjusted what they pay you next time they ask for statements as what's in your bank account is not classed as savings.

That's it, don't worry about your current account going up and down as your benefits are paid in and you then spend them.

Just let the DWP work out what is counted as actual savings when they ask for statements.

The only time you need to do anything is when they ask for statements, or if your savings account balance changes by a large amount that is not PIP/ESA, or if you reach £16,000 in total savings.
If you should start to get close to £16,000 in savings they will probably want to see statements more often to keep a closer eye on it for you.

[nukecad]

.. sometimes my bank account can go up quiet a bit before the next bills are due

Paying bills by monthly direct debit (or even a weekly/fortnightly payment plan) would stop that from happening.