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Thread: Moved to UC while in receipt of SDP, JSA, PIP and HB....Very complicated case!!

  1. #1
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    Question Moved to UC while in receipt of SDP, JSA, PIP and HB....Very complicated case!!

    I have a very complicated case that has caused me so much stress and hardship that the dwp decide after 7 months that i have no case. It is so complicated that there are actually 2 cases in one. I have read the dwp guidelines and past cases with examples and i feel that i am correct and dwp are completely wrong. But they say my case has no MR or appeal.

    Before i even attempt to write it all down i first want to ask if this is a forum for q & a from experts or it is individuals giving their experiences and advice? Even CAB had no answer and directed me back to the same people that caused this mess. Please if anyone feels they can help with my case which briefly going from esa to jsa transition whilst receiving sdp , pip and hb but being told i had to go to UC so lost my jsa/sdp.....after 3 weeks told not eligibal for uc cos i got paid sdp less then a month before so go back to jsa. A week later told as a month had past since sdp paid and my esa waz stopped i must go on uc and as i would never go back to esa i should forget the MR and any appeal. The review after the court decision about paying back pay told me to give evidence i got HB when moved to uc first time and i would get tbe back pay which i did. A montn after receiving it they say j got no case more then 30days past when i got sdp. I told them only because they made it happen.

    2nd thing is while on uc they made a mistake puting my weekly rent as monthly so could only get half of advance. Few days later it was corrected so i called and asked for other half of advance which were both given. As my claim got back dated they moved my assesment peroid back 30 days so my advances were now put down as payments for month before. So in my journal it has 17 May as being paid £×××× when i got no payment and 21/22 May i received advances of £×××.. So they gave me 7 day assessment with no advances.

    If you can understand it all please advise

    Thank you
    Last edited by Ugo2slo4me; 09-12-19 at 00:29.

  2. #2
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Whilst at first glance it seems complicated we should be able to unravel things if we take it step by step.

    Please bear with me, doing it this way, one step at a time, will give you a better answer at the end.

    So the first 2 steps are questions -

    The first question is when did you claim UC - What exact date was it when you made the claim?
    The answer to that will be crucial as you seem to have maybe been just on the cusp of when the law changed.

    The second question is on what date did your ESA stop?
    And why did it stop, were you found fit for work?

    If you were found fit for work then the letter you got will tell you what the stop date was, that date is what we need to know.
    It will be in the section on page 2 that says:
    How this decision affects your ESA payments or National
    Insurance Credits


    Because your work capability assessment shows that you can do
    some type of work this means we can't pay you ESA from {the date we need to know}.
    We will send your final ESA payment on {date}.
    Everything else will depend on those two dates.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

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    Missed esa assessment being in hospital on 12/2 and sent in evidence proving it. But my esa still got stopped only not until 4/4 but dated as 13/2. I received a esa/sdp payment on 27/3 and was advised to claim esa to jsa transition during m.r. I did so and was give a small payment of £34 and jsa appointment on 10/4. But i was told i had to move to uc there no longer jsa and i can forget about sdp and the esa m.r cos theres no going back. By 24/4 i was told im not eligibal for uc because i got sdp on 27/3 i shud go back to jsa. Once again jsa appointment on 10/5 i was told as it had been longer then 30 days since i got sdp i must now go on uc and my queries about appealing my esa refused m.r were shut down again saying i could never go back.

    I was gettng housing benefit before i was moved to uc but it was suspended when i was being pushed from piller to post by dwp and jcp. I asked how long it would take to look at my case and just last fri one of their experts said the same thing....no back pay cos 30.days past from when sdp was paid to wen i claimed uc on 5/10. I told her i first claimed on 4/4 so she changed and said 30 days past from when esa was stopped to moving to uc. I explained that that was the fault of dwp for taking 6 weeks to close claim and put it back as if they did it on purpose.

    I can go to uc advances once this is worked out pls.

  4. #4
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    Please try to keep your replies simpler.

    I understand that you want to get everything out at once, but doing things in little steps will make it clearer and less confusing.

    So what I can take from all that:
    1. Your ESA was stopped because of a failure to attend a WCA and they didn't accept you had 'good reason'.
      You did not MR/appeal that decision. (It doesn't matter why you didn't).
    2. You had your last payment of ESA, including the SDP on 27 March 2019.
    3. You tried to claim JSA on 4th April, but were (wrongly) told that you couldn't and should claim Universal Credit instead.
    4. On 24th April you were told that you couldn't claim UC (because of the SDP) and had to claim JSA instead.
    5. You eventually claimed UC on 10th May.


    I'll try and explain what has happened for you:

    Firstly the JSA-
    1. You couldn't claim Contribution Based JSA because you wouldn't have had the required NI contributions.
      Income Based JSA has been replaced by Universal Credit, so normally you would have had to claim UC instead, which is what you were told.
    2. However because you had the SDP in the last month you should have been allowed to claim IB JSA on 10th May
    3. You were told the wrong thing at the time. (You were told a few things wrong at that time).
    4. By the time it got to the 24th of May you could no longer make a claim for IB JSA because you had not had SDP in the last month.


    Next the Universal Credit-
    1. They were correct that you could not claim UC when you first tried on 24th April. That is because you had had SDP in the last month.
    2. They were correct to allow the UC claim on the 10th May. Because you hadn't had SDP in the previous month.
    3. So you now have a claim for Universal Credit in place.


    They are correct that once you have made a valid claim for Universal Credit then you cannot go back onto ESA.

    In this case because you made a claim on the 10th May when it had been over a month since you had SDP then it was a valid claim for UC that you made, and there is no going back to ESA.

    This situation has come about because you were given the wrong advicein April about not being able to claim JSA.
    Unless you have that in writing (you won't have) then it's almost impossible to challenge that you were given wrong advice.
    (You were also given the wrong advice about asking for MR/appeal of the ESA decision, but again it's your word against theirs, and probably too late to challenge that now but see below).

    All the above confirms that it is correct that you should now be on Universal Credit.
    If you haven't already got Limited Capability status in UC then ask them to refer you for a new Work Capability Assessment.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    There is an option that you can try:

    There is a special DWP team who deal with questions like this:
    If you have any queries regarding SDP and UC you can call a specialist DWP team on 0800 181 4049. From 16 January 2019, if you were getting a SDP and mistakenly make a new claim for UC the specialist team should help you return to your old benefit/s.
    Whilst I think they will only confirm what I say above, they have been known to break the rules to help people in situations similar to yours.

    A second option:
    At the risk of confusing you again, you could ask for a late appeal of the decision to stop your ESA.
    If the tribunal allows you to appeal, and if you win, then your ESA will get backpaid to the date that you started claiming UC and a 'Transitional Payment' should be added to your UC to compensate for the loss of SDP.
    You will need help from an advice organisation to stand any chance of sucess with making and winning a late appeal.
    You can find organisations local to you by putting your postcode in here: https://advicelocal.uk/find-an-adviser
    Last edited by nukecad; 10-12-19 at 07:32.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

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    Nukecad - could I also add that phone calls to dwp should be recorded BY THEM
    as I myself was sent a cd with calls on when I asked for a copy of all the recent ESA history to include phone contact
    so there should be evidence of what Ugo2slo4me was told

  6. #6
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    I read it that the correct advice to claim JSA was given over the phone, but the incorrect advice to claim UC instead was given at an appointment.

    So there will be no record of what was said at the appointment. (Other than anything that the advisor wrote down themselves, if they did write anything).

    was advised to claim esa to jsa transition during m.r. I did so and was give a small payment of £34 and jsa appointment on 10/4. But i was told i had to move to uc there no longer jsa
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

  7. #7
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    very well thought through as always nuke , i think if we were to draw a line in the sand and say the DWP have made a horlicks of this (complicated) claim , then take the position of ware we are now UC/SDP (and the new rules) and avoid some of the stuff that cannot be reversed? we might be able to see a way ahead (might)

  8. #8
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    We can only try to work out what went wrong, and why it went wrong.

    Once you can work those two out then you can think about how to put it right again, if that is still possible.
    Unfortunately, especially in cases of wrong advice, there is nothing you can do.

    The mantra is that you should have checked for yourself. (Even though you thought you were doing that by asking them).
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

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    Hello, it has been 4 months since I first wrote here. I have been pursuing this case and followinjg the process without delay. I have read almost every thing online about sdp transition from legacy benefit and hb. I have asked for the decision of the MR I requested on 31 May 2019 and was told lt is still being looked at. So I put in a MR request for the esa decision on 2/4/19 that was backdated to 13/2/19 putting me out of sdp 30 day transition period to be looked at. It has been over a month no response. I asked for DM to call me and was told up to 3 days and 3 calls.. nothing came. I put in a DSAR request from 10/2/19 - 30/6/19 for ESA to UC and nothing aftre 40 days. I made a complaint with no response 1st time, so wrote to the CR Manager and still no reply. I've accused dwp of maladministration and false accounting that they have 8 different people write in my journal to explain what are just lies. And I wonder how they are not even worried that it's in writing yet they deny it.

    So as you can see I've not given up for a year. I have all the evidence needed. I even have phone call recording of the past year. But what do I do next? I know with coronavirus things have slowed down but it has been a year now. Do I get legal advice or complain to ???????

    I also want to say.. before the DM stopped my esa she use to call me every day then every 3 days and harass me and threaten to stop esa. I made a complaint but they found she was not and had only called me 4 times and spoke for less then 10min. I just didn't follow it up because I have recording that show in 7 separate calls she spoke to and bullied me for over 40min even stayed on hold while I walked to job center. So I'm thinking this is punishment for complaining.

    Any advice?

  10. #10
    Senior Member nukecad's Avatar
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    I still think that you are flogging a dead horse here.

    Your complaints are complaints, they cannot change the fact that you made a valid claim for UC, and so now you are on UC.

    Only a revision of the ESA decision, and after that the help of the special team, could even possibly change that.
    (And even if you miraculously got back onto ESA you will be Managed Migrated to UC in a few years anyway).

    Regarding the SAR not appearing then the ICO are the people to contact about that.
    https://ico.org.uk/your-data-matters...h-the-outcome/

    Continue with the complaints if you are so minded, - but accept that you are now, correctly, on UC and if you haven't done already then ask for a new Work Capability Assessment.

    By all means get advice elsewhere, but I don't expect it to be any different.
    I don't know everything. - But I'm good at searching for, and finding, stuff.

    Migration from ESA to Universal Credit- Click here for information.

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